chimneys too small to be swept in any other manner than by the use of climbing boys. It was true there were a great many chimneys of that description, but they belonged to those who could well afford to alter them if they pleased. But it was in that very description of chimneys that the greatest danger to the lives of the climbing boys existed. Not fewer than five children had lost their lives by such means, in the course of the last year. Nor was this to be wondered at, when it was known, that in some houses recently built, the chimneys were only seven inches square, and that the children employed to sweep them could not be more than four or five years old. Yet with such facts admitted, was it to be said, that the House was proceeding in a hurry? In a hurry to do what? To save the lives of those poor little creatures who were constantly exposed to death, and that too of the most terrible nature. But it could not fairly be said that he wished to proceed in a hurry, if he proposed to make the bill operative in 1819, in order that time might be given to all the parties affected by it, to make those alterations which the new mode of sweeping chimneys would require. He could not agree in what had fallen from his noble friend; it would have the effect of sacrificing the children of the poor in order to preserve the chimneys of the rich-a thing so monstrous in itself, that he was certain no man would let it dwell in his thoughts for a moment. Lord Milton hoped his hon. friend would recollect, that his objections were not made to the proposed measure per se. They only went to effect a more mature consideration of the probable consequences of it. It should be considered, that the measure might probably be viewed differently in another place, where measures upon which the House had been unanimous, were altogether rejected. This made it necessary to examine the matter minutely before a final decision was given. Mr. Lyltelton trusted, that the House would not neglect any thing which it was their duty to do, from a consideration of what might be done in another place. He had, however, no doubt that the humane and energetic arguments which his hon. friend had used in support of the measure, would also have their effect in the other place alluded to. With respect to a tax on the use of climbing boys, he thought that such a plan would not have the intended effect. It might operate certainly in raising the prices for the sweeping of chimneys, but it would still lay the same road open to abuses as before; for the rich would have the means of paying for the use of boys in sweeping, and would thereby be the means of encouraging the sacrifice of human life, which it was now sought to avoid. The petition was ordered to lie on the table. GAME BILL.] Mr. G. Bankes said, that in the motion which he was about to make, he expected the support, not of those members alone who were anxious to protect the game of the country, but of those also who were solicitous to diminish the number of offences connected with the unlawful destruction of game. Most of these offences would be got rid of, if the legislature could effectually prevent the buying and selling of game; for it seldom happened that poachers killed game for sustenance, or for the mere gratification of their own tastes. As the law stood at present, all persons, qualified and unqualified, were forbidden to sell game. Unqualified persons were also virtually forbidden to purchase game, but there was no such restriction on qualified persons. His wish was to put all persons on the same footing in this respect; and by the bill, for which he was about to move, to enact, that all persons, qualified or not, should be liable to the same penalties for buying game as those inflicted by the existing law on unqualified persons so purchasing it. The hon. gentleman then moved, "That leave be given to bring in a Bill for the farther preventing of offences connected with the unlawful destruction and sale of game." Mr. Curven, thought the proposition of the hon. gentleman quite inadequate to the attainment of the object in view. It would only go to make the game laws still more odious than they were. He was by no means one of those who thought this not a fit subject for legislation. On the contrary, he was fully impressed with the advantages of increasing the inducements to gentlemen to reside in the country, by protecting the game for their amusement. But while the present oppressive and unjust code of laws existed on the subject, it was in vain to think of putting an end to the crimes which they generated. At present the right of game was confined to landed proprietors. Now it was well known that in this country the proportion FEB. 18, 1818. [510 Mr. G. Bankes professed himself wholly incompetent to execute the task which the hon. member for Carlisle wished him to undertake. the game laws something better if he All he desired was, to make could. The omission which the proposed bill tended to supply, appeared to him to be a casual one, and easily to be remedied. by the hon. gentleman would be beneficial, Sir C. Burrell thought the bill proposed by putting the rich and the poor on an equal footing. It had been most justly said by the late Mr. Fox, that, without a violation of the laws of property, he could not see how the game laws could be much altered at present. *509] Election Laws Amendment Bill. which commercial property bore to landed property, was as seven to one. He could see no objection to making game private property, up to a certain extent, and to doing away all qualifications not founded on property. Severe penalties were never productive of the effect intended by them. While the plundering of a farmer's field of turnips and such articles was felony by law, the practice was general, as the punishment was too severe to be inflicted; but as soon as it was reduced to a moderate fine, the practice entitely ceased. He strongly recommended the hon. gentleman not to content himself with so inefficient a proposition as that which he had just made, but to go to the root of the evil, and endeavour to reform the whole system of the game laws. As to making the pur chase of game penal, the only consequence would be, that the smaller culprits would be punished, while those of more importance would escape. For instance, such an individual as the lord mayor of London must have game. He would not purchase it himself, but others would purchase it for him; and this would take place, whatever statutes the legislature might enact. Mr. Warre was surprised that his hon. friend could imagine that in the present state, temper, and constitution of society, any legislative measure could effectually prevent the sale of game. But two years ago an hon. member brought in a bill on this subject, the enactments of which were so severe that it was deemed expedient to repeal it last session. The hon. member who had just sat down, had given his hon. friend good counsel, although it would be no easy task to set about reforming the whole system of the game laws. On this subject he had that morning met with a passage in Mr. Justice Blackstone, which he would read to the House. It was as follows:-" Though the forest laws are now mitigated, and by degrees grown entirely obsolete, yet from this root has sprung a bastard slip, known by the name of the game law, now arrived to, and wantoning in, its highest vigour: both founded upon the same unreasonable notions of permanent property in wild creatures; and both productive of the same tyranny to the commons; but with this difference, that the forest laws established only one mighty hunter throughout the land, the game laws have raised a little Nimrod in " every manor.' #4 Comm. 416.. 28. The House divided: Ayes, 60; Noes, Taylor, pursuant to the notice he gave NORTHERN CIRCUIT.] Mr. M. A yesterday, moved, mittee be appointed to consider whether "That a Select Comany and what steps may be necessary to be taken to give to the counties of Westmorland, Cumberland, Northumberland, and Durham, and the town and county of tages of assizes twice in each year as are Newcastle upon Tyne, the same advannow possessed by all the other counties in opinion thereupon to the House."-The England and Wales; and to report their motion was agreed to, and a committee was accordingly appointed. Mr. Wynn having moved the farther conELECTION LAWS AMENDMENT BILL.] sideration of the report of this bill, said, he was desirous of proposing a clause, which might obviate an objection made when the bill was going through the comcounties there were separate general sesmittee. The objection was, that in some sions of the peace and quarter sessions, counties, and that in such places the sesholden for the different divisions of such sion might elapse without the bill being taken any notice of. To prevent this, he should propose the following clause:"And whereas in some counties there are separate general sessions of the peace, and quarter sessions holden for the differ ther enacted, that in all such cases the ent divisions of such counties: be it furhigh sheriff shall summon a general session of all the justices of the peace for such county, by public advertisement, to be holden at such place where such general sessions or meetings are usually holden, upon some day not more than two months from the passing of this act, for the purpose of carrying this act into execution; where such appointment of the number of the polling places for such county shall be made, subject to the like regulations herein before directed."-The clause was agreed to.-Mr. Wynn then said, that on the suggestion of the member for Rochester, he should propose an amendment to the ninth clause; although it did not occur to him that in its present state it could produce the inconveniences he apprended. Mr. Barnett feared it would be attended with some evil, if, according to the provisions of the clause in question, it became necessary that 400 voters should have polled on the second day. He knew that in the place which he had the honour of representing, the question of residence was frequently agitated, and often gave rise to such delay as would render it very difficult to poll 400 voters by the close of the second day. Mr. Wynn said, that the bill provided for the erection of many booths in which the undisputed voters might be received. There was, besides, to be another booth in which the returning officer should sit to decide upon any such questions as that of residence. This would, in his opinion, obviate the inconvenience. The returning officer would thus be enabled to settle disputed cases, while the poll was going on without interruption in the other booths. Mr. Lamb said, he felt considerable alarm from many provisions of the bill. The necessity that 400 voters should have polled on the second day, unless it could be proved that they were prevented by riot from making their appearance, went to place a dangerous kind of power in the hands of the returning officer. That power being subject to inquiry before the House, would be hardly a sufficient guard against the abuse of it. The returning officer by this means might be enabled to decide immediately upon the election of a candidate, in cases where, if not prevented by riot from voting, the other candidate might have had a superior number of electors. It might frequently happen, as it did in the late election for Norfolk, that a candidate could not bring up a sufficient number of voters at the time provided by the act. For these reasons he was desirous that such parts of the bill as were questionable might be either postponed or their operations merely tried at any elections which might take place during the sitting of the present parliament. Sir. W. Burroughs would agree that there were some objections to the bill. In the borough which he represented, many of the electors lived at some distance from the place in which the election was held. Some as far as ten or twelve miles. The bill, with respect to many, would have the effect either of disfranchising them, or of throwing upon candidates the unnecessary expense of bringing up non-resident electors. He feared that some of its provisions held out no small temptation to riot. Mr. Wilberforce said, it did not appear to him, that it was too much to require, that 400 voters should have polled on the second day. The clause, which made an exception to this, in the event of riot, sơ far from encouraging that evil, would, he thought, contribute to lessen it. Persons would then be more cautious in commencing any disturbance to prevent voters from attending at the polling places, because such disturbance would naturally give rise to a suspicion that it originated in unworthy motives. The bill did not require that each candidate should, on the second day, have polled 400 voters, but that 400 on the whole should have voted. As to the inconvenience of bringing up non-resident voters, he believed, whatever the candidates might feel upon the score of expense, that such voters had no objection to come occasionally as well to see their friends, as from some other little considerations that might be of service to them. The clause could not be attended with inconvenience to the candidate, whose strength lay principally in non-re sident voters. Lord Milton did not think that the clause in question could be attended with the inconveniencies which some gentlemen seemed to apprehend. The com mittee to which the measure was referred for consideration, were not of opinion that to require 400 persons to have polled on the second day, could be of any inconvenience. An objection was made in the committee, that an unfair advantage might be taken of the clause against those candidates whose strength lay principally in non-resident electors. He did not think that any danger of an unfair election could arise from this. The only thing he wished to suggest was, that throughout the bill, wherever the word polled occurred it might be struck out, for the purpose of inserting the words" tendered their votes.' This, in his mind, would be a considerable improvement. Mr. Marryat feared that the bill would throw an unnecessary expense upon candidates, by obliging them to bring up voters at a time when there was no occasion for them. For this and other reasons he was desirous that it should be post poned. Sir W. Burroughs could not but apprehend that the bill would cause great inconvenience and unnecessary expense, in many cases, to candidates whose strength lay in non-resident electors. In the heat of an expected contest they would naturally be induced to bring up as many voters as the bill required, even when there was no occasion for them. Mr. W. Smith said, he knew many instances of election, in which 400 voters were nor polled on the two first days, nor upon any day up to the tenth. The clause requiring that such a number should poll, would have the effect of placing within the reach of the returning officer a great degree of partiality in the exercise of his power. He might continue to object to any single vote even for the space of two hours. Mr. Wynn said, that the number of booths for receiving votes which the bill provided would obviate the inconvenience apprehended. It did not matter how long the returning officer might be deciding upon a disputed vote, because, in the meantime, the election would be going on in the other booths. From all he had heard upon the subject, the opinion seemed to be, that any candidate who, on the two first days, was not able to bring up 400 electors, could have no chance of success. Such being the case, would they now, by postponing the bill, leave all the cities and counties throughout the kingdom subject to the inconvenience, and candidates to the unnecessary expense of a protracted election? This might be done as the law stood at present, by any individual who could on each day bring up seven electors. There were numerous instances of this. In Devonshire the poll was kept open for three days by a person who had only nineteen votes. In Bristol it was not closed for nine or ten days. In the county of Berks it was kept open for fifteen days by an individual who could bring forward only 500 votes. He remembered a borough, in which there were only 200 electors, and in which the poll was not closed in it for eleven days. Such were the evils which were intended to be provided against by the measure. (VOL. XXXVII.) Knowing that they existed, he would submit it to the House whether it would be politic to postpone the bill to a more distant period. Mr. Lushington expressed his hopes, that the bill would be put into such a shape as would secure its passing into a law. Mr. Brougham said, he was a friend to the principle of the bill, and to most of its details; but he had some doubts as to the number of 400. Perhaps it would be better to have a smaller number of voters or a greater number of days. An objection might also be made to throwing the expense of the candidates upon the electors, and perhaps the present time might be regarded as peculiarly unfit. The clause respecting the assessment to the land tax, was much to be approved of, as since the redemption of the land tax the present mode was almost equal to a forfeiture of the qualification. an General Thornton was of opinion, that the clause would increase the expense of bringing down the outlying voters; exception should therefore be made in their favour, or else the clause should be withdrawn. Instances had occurred of the poll having been kept open after the third candidate had withdrawn, to enable the second candidate to get to the head of the poll. Sir W. Burroughs said, that the, bill ought to be recommitted. Should that not be agreed to, he should feel it his duty to move that the House be counted. Mr. Wynn thought he had cause to complain of the proceeding of the hon. gentleman, as the bill had already been put off for ten days, that there might be ample time to consider the subject. He should move that the bill be re-committed for to-morrow, and he hoped it would be read a third time the next day. If gen. tlemen would look to the case of Norwich, they would find that 3000 voters had polled in the course of two days. That fact appeared to him a sufficient justification of the clause in the bill respecting the 400 voters that were required to poll in the course of two days. The bill was ordered to be recommitted to-morrow. Earl Grosvenor felt it his duty to say a few words before the bill should pass through the committee. He had hoped that their lordships would have heard something on the subject of economy in the Prince Regent's speech, but in that expectation the House and the country had been grievously disappointed. Not withstanding this omission, it was a notorious fact that the finances of the country were in a most deplorable state; for the income, though a boast had been made of the improvement of the revenue, did not cover the expenditure by many millions. In this situation it was reasonable to have hoped that ministers, if they neglected to bring forward the subject on the meeting of parliament, would at least have done something at a very early part of the session, to encourage the expectation of their being disposed to resort to that system of reduction and economy which could alone avert the ruin that threatened the country. No indication of any such disposition had, however, been given; and now, after three years of peace, the country had still to endure a weight of unnecessary expenditure. He had formerly alluded to reductions which ought to be made, and was still of opinion that considerable savings might be effected in different branches of the public expenditure, and particularly in that of the army. If the army on the frontiers of France were recalled, a more economical arrangement with respect to the military force might be made. While in a state of peace, was it not most absurd to persist in maintaining an army of 100,000 men? Notwithstanding what had fallen from a noble earl with regard to the state of France, on the first day of the session, he could not agree with him as to the danger of withdrawing the army of occupation. He could not partake entirely in the view of that noble earl, and was rather inclined to believe that time had removed many of the objections which might have been urged against withdrawing the allied troops. He agreed with the noble earl in thinking, that the occupation of the throne of France by the Bourbon family was most favourable to the interests of Europe, as well as of France, provided they adhered to constitutional principles. This, he was persuaded, was felt to be the case, in that country; and though there might be different parties there, and though he carried his opinion as to the supporting the present French government, as far as he believed that opinion ought to be carried, yet he could see no necessity why any part of the military force of this country should be maintained on the French frontiers. Whether Buonaparté was popular in France to the extent which had been stated, he could not pretend to determine; but however popular that person might be, he trusted that this country would not be so unjust and impolitic as to completely mix itself in the domestic affairs of another. To a certain degree he was ready to admit that interference might be a duty, but with domestic parties we had really nothing to do. Feeling and lamenting as he did the state of the finances of the country, he could not help expressing his surprise at finding a measure like the present in progress through their lordships House. That there should be thirty millions of exchequer bills afloat, in addition to the other circulating paper, was a very melancholy consideration. The serious importance of the measure would be appreciated when their lordships considered that the issue now proposed equalled any that had ever been made in this country during the late long and expensive war, It must be evident that this increased circulation of paper tended more and more to depreciate the regular coin of the realm, and to render more difficult, if not entirely to prevent the removal of that restriction on the payments of the Bank which all their lordships so seriously deplored. Impressed with these opinions, he could not suffer this important measure to go through the committee without calling their lordships attention to it. The Earl of Liverpool said, he did not. wish to enter into any discussion on the questions respecting the army of occupation and the family of Bourbon, which the noble earl had started. With regard to the subject of finance, the noble earl had gone so far as to state, that the income of the country was many millions below the expenditure. He should only say, that when the accounts were fairly before the House, he should be prepared to meet the noble earl on this question. Then would be the proper time for any discussion which the noble earl might think proper to bring forward; but he would then find that the opinion he now entertained was most erroneous. The noble lord had complained of the superabundance of exchequer bills; but if he inquired into the real state of the case, he would find that there was, upon the whole, a reduction, |