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might rely that the public would not be and the Scotch militia families bill.
deceived by it. In fact, such a bill, with Adjourned to Monday.
the insertion of this word “ express,"

Monday June 12. promised no good, and threatened much On the motion for the third reading of harm; and, therefore, if that word were the SEAT-IN PARLIAMENT SALE BILL. : not omitted, he would feel it his duty to Sir T. Turton rose to express his senvote against the bill altogether.

timents on the principle of the bill, not Mr. Lyttleton expected much from having had an opportunity to do so in this bill at the out-set, but it had since a former stage. He expressed his assent been so mutilated, and would be so to generally to parliamentary reform. The tally changed if the word objected to · bill was greatly docked, but still he haili were retained, that he could not think of ed it as it stood as the harbinger of fusupporting the shadow when the sub- ture good things. At the same time he stance was gone. He lamented very se- must say the bill had greatly disappointriously the conduct of ministers, who ed his expectations. were pursuing a course calculated to dis- Mr. Johnsione contended that the conappoint the reasonable expectations of duct of parliament of late years had been the country, for that moderate reform such as to entitle them to the thanks of which he would prefer to any violent the country, in comparison with what it change.

had been uuder their ancestors The question being loudly called for, Mr. Abercrombie would have voted for the house divided, and the numbers this bill if his only objection had been were--For inserting the word " express," that it did not go far enough. But this 97 Against it, 74Majority, 23. was far from being the only objection.

Mr. Whitbbread then declared that he As the bill stood at present it would do entirely disapproved of the bill, after the a great deal of mischief. alterations which it had undergone; and Mr. H. Thornton thought it absolute although he should not be present at the ly necessary that there should be at least third reading, he hoped a majority of a declaratory law to shew that the sale of the house would then throw it out. seats in parliament was a crime.

Mr. Curwen said, that although many The Secretary at War was a great adalterations had taken place in the bill, mirer of the British constitution as it exyet still he wished it to pass, as the prin- isted, and saw no reason for any reform. ciple would remain acknowledged in the He would, however, vote for the bill. preamble, and the country might enter- Mr. Adam observed, that when it was tain better hopes of success in future. stated and admitted that seats in that

Mr. Ponsonby said, that only three house were bought and sold to a great lines and a half of the original bill re- extent, some remedy was necessary. mained, and he entirely disapproved of He objected to the word “ express," as the bill as it now stood.

applied to an agreement, which was a • The question was then put, that the novelty in the law. bill be engrossed, when there were The Solicitor-General defended the Ayes, 84 | Noes, 36-Majority 48. word " express," and contended that it * It was then ordered to be read a third was a common expression applied in this time on Monday next.

sense in acts of parliament. The Attorney-General expressed his Lord A. Humilton contended that the desire to withdraw his Seditious Societies gentlemen on the other side were making Bill; at the same time he intimated his an experiment on the vitals of the constiintention to introduce it again early in tution, by the continuance of the most the next session of parliament.

glaring abuses. To correct these ruinous Saturday July 10.

principles and practices his hon. friend 3. The royal assent was given by com- (Mr. Curwen) had introduced his bill, of "mission to the customs regulation bill, which he was a warm supporter. But the Irish loan bill, the treasury bills bill, it was entirely altered, and would tend the militia subalterns, the excise offices only to make the matter worse. He provision, the Irish paper duty, the thought that it would be better to reject judges accommodation, the Irish spirits, the bill, and take up the business next the Irish militia pay and cloathing, the session. auditors of public accounts, the assessed Mr. D. Giddy maintained that propertaxes, the lotteries, the coffee dealers, ty ought to be the criterion of represen

tation in that house and as a corollary

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from this he maintained, that property pledge to the country of its future intencould only be represented through the tion upon the vital question of reform mean of influence or interest.

and thereby giving peace and confidence Sir F. Burdett, on every consideration to the public mind. With that object it he was able to give that bill, from the is my intention to come down to this moment of its original introduction, and house and propose a short resolution, through the various discussions which calculated to inform both this house and attended its further progress, declared the people the length I am inclined to go. he could arrive at no other conclusion I have only to add, that my views on the than that it was a measure of indemnity subject are neither hastily considered, or for past corruptions, and of security for suddenly put into a practical system. future similar offences. You yourselves Whatever opinion may be ultimately have admitted the propriety of the ques- pronounced upon them, I feel the contion. You have discussed a species of solation of having weighed them with atwhat you call reform. Whatever reform tention. I have, therefore, only to take such a measure may create in the regula- the present opportunity of giving notice, tion of your house, I strenuously deny that on to-morrow, I will submit to this that it tends to any reform in the repre- house a resolution, binding it early in sentation of the people. I am, Mr. the next session to take into its consiSpeaker,, and ever have been, ready to deration the propriety of a parliamentary avow my opinions upon all public sub- reforin. jects, and I do presume my conviction Mr. Curwen defended the bill even of the absolute necessity of a reform in under the change which he lamented had the constitution is very well ascertained. taken place.

*. Were I then to subscribe to the present Mr.' Windham argued against the measure, as constituting any essential principle of the bill. He agreed with the part of the reform which I feel to be ne- hon. Baronet's (Burdett) observations, cessary, I should then be guilty of not namely, that this was asort of attempt at only having aggravated the evil, but of reform, and, with him, he reprobated it, having added injury to insult, in the dis- because it could produce no good. This appointment such a course of conduct hon. friend still clung to his amputated would give to the fair hopes of the coun- bill, consoled by the old adage, that try. I speak this, because I am con- “ half a loaf is better than no bread." vinced that such an affectation of re- Mr. W. concluded with assuring the form would not satisfy that enlightened house that such a delusive attempt would portion of the British people, to whose only, by its deception, exasperate the judgment, and whose discrimination, people. whatever the gentlemen who meet here Mr. Perceval began by expressing his may say to the contrary, I am, and ever surprise that gentlemen on the other side shall be, most desirous to give credit and should express sentiments so hostile to attention. All that has or is demanded the bill which they had set out with supare the rights of the constitution ! Upon porting. The right hon. gentleman who that constitution individuals will speak spoke last, attempted to show that the according to the particular bias of their bill was not calculated to answer its opinions and their objects. The time is avowed end. He would ask, if a prer now arrived when I feel it necessary no amble such as that of the bill in queslonger to leave room for those insinuati- tion, pledging varliament against corrupons which have been so frequently,and so tion, and al species of that corrupt trafgenerally expressed under the definition fick, was nothing? As to the introducof public demagogues and popular agita- tion of the oath, he thought that the tors, and of which I know that I was the practical difficulties, resulting from it, butt. On my part there shall be no am- seemed to be admitted even by the right biguity, I wish the people, upon the hon. gentleman who spoke last. He sinvital questien of reform, to know the na- cerely thought that the bill in its present ture and extent of my opinion; and I shape was calculated to do much good, am determined that this house shall not and that it might now be safely passed separate--that its members shall not re- . into a law. And..

3 turn amongst their constituents in fact, Mr. Tierney agreed with Mr. Perce that this house shall not continue longer val, that before the house would rise that in the contaminated state in which it night, some one or other of its members has exhibited itself, without giving some would be exposed to imputations of in

sincerity of conduct in the progress of 10001. as if such a fine could be a prethe bill then pending. When his hon. ventive, but this was of a character friend introduced this bill, he confessed with the rest, and was only throwing a he hailed it as a source of real good to the shield about the members; and yet, if best interests of the country; but since the sincerity of the right hon. gentleman. that period the bill had undergone such was appealed to, it might be difficult for changes, it had been so mutilated and de- him to account why there should be any faced, that its very principle was essen- difference between the elected and electially altered, and consequently its end tors. He had insisted upon the intromust be different. He denied therefore duction of “ express," which did away that he was justly liable to any charge of the whole force and use of the clause. inconsistency for now voting against the When that right hon. gentleman acted as bill; for what he had originally supporto a new reformer recently, he took a difed was not that which he now opposed, ferent course with respect to his own and that was the reason why he opposed measure. [Here Mr. Tierney read pasit. The 500l. penalty which was intended sages from Mr. Perceval's bill to prevent to be imposed on the person giving the the sale of offices, and observed that the bribe, not one syllable of thut clause now term “ express" was not included in that remained in the bill! He would ask, was bill, nor ought not in the present.] Bilt the omission of such a clause no material he could not believe it possible that the alteration in the nature of the bill? But right hon. gentleman really meant to prethe truth was, that the right hon. gen- vent the sale of seats in that house, his tleman through the whole progress of conduct in the treatment of that bill the bill betrayed a great anxiety to throw was totally irreconcilable with such an a shield round the members of that house; intention. He again adverted to the there was no scruple in dealing out preamble, and said there was nothing in punishments to the electors, as the baser it---it was joking with the public---it was part, but there was manifested upon all laughing in their faces, and giving them occasions a wonderful jealousy for the more then pretence for saying to that elected. Now, unfortunately, whatever house what Dr. Johnson said to Macwas the cause, the public did not think pherson--" Hereafter I shall be more precisely that way. They did not think inclined to believe what you shall prove, them altogether above punishment. The than what you shall say. They, indeed, right hon. gentleman who had thrown said a great deal in all conscience, and out such sly hints against the sincerity of it was now time for them to do something. others, had brought his own to rather a The public had observed the course they queer trial in the committee. He was a had taken during the session, and would friend to the bill, and the moment he got not be inattentive to the manner in it into the committee, he never stopt till which they would close their career. he succeeded in making it as unlike the Though his hon. friend was deserving of measure he professed to befriend as any great praise for having introduced the measure could possibly be. The bill went bill, yet, after the alterations it had uninto the committee with the clause of pe- dergone, it would do him but little crenalty; the clause respecting the oath, dit: and he (Mr. Tierney) would advise and that regarding the office; and before him to take care that it should go out to it was allowed to come out of it, the right the world not as his, but as the measure hon. gentleman has deprived it altogether of the right hon. gentleman. For the of penalty, oath, and office! As for the reasons he had stated, he must oppose preamble, notwithstanding the fine eu- the bill. logium the right hon. gentleman had pass- Mr. Wilberforce said a few words aed on it, he thought it amounted to nei- gainst the bill. He thought that if the ther more nor less than nothing. The bill was suffered to pass, it would stand bribery act would not be carried into ef- in the way of something better, and that, fect by it--and why? because that might on the other hand, if it were thrown out, go to affect members as well as voters, something more effectual would be suband there was no saying too much about stituted in its place. Besides, if it did the tenderness the right hon. gentleman not pass, there were some, and among had inanifested for the former, though, to those perhaps his right hon, friend (Mr. be sure, it was a fine thing to talk big of Perceval), who might think that enough mulcting a minister in the penalty of was done already

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VOL. VI.

The gallery was then cleared for a di- points ought not to be concluded withvision, when three divisions took place. out a great deal of deliberation.

The first, on the third reading---Ayes, Mr. Abercrombie admitted that no98-Noes, 83-Majority for the third thing could be more proper than all due reading, 15.

caution, but contended that some unneThe second, that the bill do pass cessary delay had taken place. Ayes, 97-Noes, 85-Majority 12.

Mr. Perceval observed, that the comThe third divison was on the title of the missioners had a great deal of inquiry to bill-Ayes, 133-Noes, 28-Maj. 105. make, and that they were perfectly right

The other orders of the day were then in taking care not to act with precipidisposed of, and the house adjourned. tancy. Tuesday, June 13.

The bill was then read a third time, Mr. Wardlé gave notice that he and passed. should on Monday next move for a re- Mr. Holdsworth rose to submit a moturn, shewing the amount of the annual tion on the subject of the exemption of national expenditure. This motion was foreign property in the funds from the connected with what had formerly pass-income tax. he thought the state of the ed on the subject of introducing greater Continent was such, that foreigners were economy in the management of public compelled to invest their money, from a business, by which, as he had frequently principle of security, in our funds; and stated, it was his opinion, that eleyen it was owing to this that Mr. Perceval millions might annually be saved. was able to borrow money at so low a

Lord H. Petty withdrew his motion rate. This exemption was taxing of our for a copy of the instructions given to friends, in order to serve our enemies. Mr. Erskine relative to the attack upon He should now move a resolution, the Chesapeake, in consequence of un- “ That this house will in the next session derstanding from Mr. Canning that nego- enquire into the expediency of disconciations were still pending withAmerica. tinuing the clause in the property act

The Scotch judicature bill was re- 13 Geo. III. which exempts the funded ported.

property of foreigners." : Mr. Horner observed, that next to a Mr. Baring contended, that the sareform in the representation of Scotland, ving of the comparatively trifling sum of the adınission of jury trials in civil causes 60,0001. a year should not be put in would be the most valuable benefit that competition with the character which could be conferred on that country.-- this country had always maintained for He next adverted to the enormous abuse honour and good faith, and which enabled in the law of Scotland of extracting the this country to draw its resources even decree. He stated, that in Scotland the from those nations with which it might whole of the proceedings, statements of be at war. facts, and arguments of counsel, were S ir T. Turton supported the resoluentered upon the record, and before the tion. suitor, in whose favour the decree was : Mr. D. Giddy said, that the sole right made, could proceed to execution he of taxation depended on protection being was forced to have a copy of this volu- afforded. But as these foreigners owed minous proceeding, often amounting to a this country no allegiance, they did not thousand pages, every page of which was appear to him to be the proper subjects signed by an officer of the court, and an of taxation. every signature there was a fee! He Mr. Fuller thonght, that as the proInentioned instances where the objects perty of these foreigners was protected, of suits, though amounting to 300l. were as well as our own, at an immense exinferior to the expences of extracting the pence of blood and treasure, it was but decree, for which 500l. was sometimes fair that they should bear a share of the paid. He also thought that the com- burden. There were a number of fomissioners ought to have made some reigners who got their living in this counspecific report on this point, instead of try, and some who were even said to causing unnecessary. delays by entering make their 60001, a year for warbling upun subjects which did not concern and pleasing people's ears; in God's them.

name let them have it, if people chose Mr. Dundus observed, that the subject to give it to them; but when we were · was of so much, importance that these compared to a ship in distress, and net knowing where to look for taxes, he wantonly disabled in hunting as in the thought we should make them pay some- soberer occupation of the farmer? Yet thing for the protection of their property. we had heard, that on such a day the

Mr. Perceval said, that after all the hounds threw out at such a place-fine consideration he had given the subject, running- and a number of horses thrown he was rather inclined to think that the behind, three in at the death, and three discontinuance of this exemption was killed in the chace; and the account neither incompatible with the principles closed with remarking that it was a gloof justice or policy.

rious day's sport. Would we send such Mr. Holdsworth then said, that as he offenders as these to the house of corsaw the temper of the house was not rection! If not, where was the fairness friendly to his notice, he should with- of this bill? He should conclude by draw it for the present,

moving, that this bill be committed on Lord Ossulston rose to make his pro- this day three months. mised motion, for a resolution of the Mr. Wilberforce complained of the house to limit the granting of pensions treatment given to the bill by the right and sinecure places. He made a few ob- hon. gentleman (Mr. Windham) consiservations founded upon a part of the evi- dering the respectable authority by dence taken before a committee which which it came recommended to them, had been appointed by the house, but It was a measure, he remarked, that which had not made its report.

had been long called for, and every man After being called to order by Mr. acquainted with a crowded city must be Perceval,

sensible of the necessity of it. If necesThe Speaker declared it to be irregu- sary, he argued, that the bill might be lar to make any motion upon the pro- altered or improved, but begged that ceedings, before the committee should they would not throw it out without due make their report.

consideration, as, by such a step, the The resolution was then put, and ne- existing evil would be increased. The gatived without a division.

different species of cruelty might be sb On the order of the day being read far defined as to render the act applicafor the house going into a committee on ble to most of the cases that appeared the animal cruelty prevention bill, Mr. necessary. Windham stated his objections to it, and Messrs. Perceval and Giddy, though declared that he did not consider it of friendly to the principle of the bill, opsufficient importance to call for an act posed it, as tending to establish a system of legislation, and particularly one of so of indefinite jurisprudence, verging to novel a kind as this was. He was of tyranny. opinion, that the bill would open a dread- Sir Samuel Romilly, Lord Porchester, ful source of arbitrary vexation. Great Messrs. W, Smith, Jekyl, and Morris, censure would alight upon a poor man supported it, for whipping up his fatigued horse to the On a division, there appeared — For discharge of his duty, while the man, the Speaker's leaving the chair, 40who, a little before, had been riding for Against it, 27. the creation of an appetite, overlooked The house then resolved itself into à the application of his spur to the sides committee on the bill, Sir C. Bunbury of his own horse. Thus men would in the chair, and after sitting a short never be wanting to exercise all the time, resumed rather abruptly, in conchristian virtues at the expence of others. sequence of its being discovered that He should object to the ambiguity also only 12 members were present. --Ad.: in which the bill was worded. Was it journed, not as malicious an act if a horse was

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STATE PAPERS.

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TO THE SPANISH NATION. stroyed.--Our fathers did not know It is three ages, Spaniards, since how to preserve the precious deposi

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