that having opposed the repeal of the Test and question. For several years in this House I Corporation Acts, I brought forward the Ca- had taken a most active part in opposition to tholic question with the sole desire of con- that question; I had so taken it from the great tinuing in office, and of appropriating to my- doubt I entertained, whether the removal of self the honour due to others. I have long Catholic disabilities would restore tranquillity been silent under this charge, but I can be to Ireland, and I therefore maintained an unsilent no longer. In the first place I thought compromising hostility, taking care, however, the time had hardly come when I ought to to avoid all asperity of manner. In 1822 [qu. place my conduct in the proper light, and I 1828] I was again left in the minority on that therefore left the charge unnoticed; but the question. There were, then, circumstances time has now come, when my defence of my which showed me that it was more dangerous conduct on the Catholic question ought to be to continue the resistance I had offered, than put beyond all doubt. In the first place, I to yield. I have often said, that my opinion did not undertake to settle the question on the subject is unchanged, for I had doubts of the Test and Corporation Acts. As the whether the people of Ireland would be beneMinister of the Crown I opposed that fited by the change, which would give strength question. I was beaten-I was left in a to dissent, and power to the many. From time minority on that question, and being so, to time I found that the success of the ProI did not attempt to defraud of any honour testant party was balanced by the success of those who had previously advocated the settle- their opponents, and I thought it hopeless to ment of the question; for opposed as I was to maintain, with effect, a further resistance; it, I privately believed that after the vote of but, at the same time, I thought there could the House of Commons, it was better that the be nothing more unfortunate than that I, who question should be settled; and in that con- had been the most strenuous in opposition, viction I did what I could to facilitate an should be the individual to undertake the amicable adjustment. Then, says the right settlement of that question. It was not for the hon. Gentleman, why did you not resign when sake of any personal sacrifices that 1 was called you found you could not carry your measure? on to make, for I always expected that such sacri The hon. Member, with his usual discretion, fices must be made, that I felt a repugnance to it, wields a two-edged sword, which equally but that I felt I must necessarily lose the conwounds friends and foes. Is it an imputation fidence of the party with whom I had so long that Ministers do not resign when they cannot acted, and I did feel it unfortunate that I, who carry into effect a measure to which they are had evinced the most decided opposition, should favourable? (Hear, hear.) If it is so, then, be the individual to introduce the very measure why do not the present Ministers resign? I had so long opposed. It happened that I (Hear.) I made no charge against them for was absent from London in the year 1828, and not resigning, and I now say that it is not I wrote my opinion on the policy of settling fair to infer improper conduct because Minis- the Catholic question to my noble Friend, I ters do not at once resign, when they are de- stated-"I have thus expressed my opinion feated in their attempt to carry a particular without reserve on the first great question of measure. I will now state the whole truth as all, on the policy of seriously considering this connected with the Catholic question, and, long-agitated question with a view to an adhaving done so, I will appeal to every man, justment. I have proved, I trust, that it is no whether, in what I did, I was not fully justi- false delicacy with respect to past opinions, fied. On the 9th July, 1828, I was called on nor any fear of charges of inconsistency that to form part of the Ministry. There had will prevent me from taking that part which been three changes of the Government. The the present danger and the new position of administration of Lord Goderich had lasted 8 affairs seem to require. I am ready to do so if months. There were three parties in the it is absolutely necessary. I think there is less state: there were the Tories, the Whigs, and of danger in the settlement of the question than the friends of Mr. Canning. In the Govern-in leaving it, as it has been, an open question, ment of Lord Goderich two of these parties by the effects of which the Government has had been united; why they did not retain been on many occasions paralyzed. I must at office, I have yet to learn. I have never heard the same time say, that I think it would not the cause; but the fact was that that Admiui-conduce to the satisfactory settlement of the stration failed to meet the Parliament. In the month of January the Duke of Wellington was called on to form an Administration, and the Duke and I were obliged to postpone the meeting of Parliament for one week. We met the Parliament one month after the Government, composed of two of the parties in the state had quitted the Government, and we were beaten on the question of the Test and Corporation Acts. Is there any gentleman who would have had us leave the King at such a moment on that question? (Hear.) I now come to the heavier charge of the Catholic

question, that the charge of it should be left in my hands. Personal considerations are entirely out of the question. I show this by avowing, that in case of necessity, I am ready to undertake the duty, but I think I could support the measure more safely, if my support of it were given out of the House. Any authority which it may be thought I possess among the Protestant party would be increased by my retirement. I have too deeply been engaged in opposition to concessions to make it advantageous that I should be the individual to originate this measure." (Hear.) I

meution this, Sir, to show that circumstances fied I would abdicate my functions, and not had compelled me to undertake the settlement stand here to offer weak opposition to the of that question. (Hear, hear.) I did after-measure. I ascert, however, that I am at wards undertake to introduce a measure for liberty to offer this opposition. A great part the settlement of that question, but I remaiu- of the speech of the hon. Gentleman turned ed till January, 1829, in the belief that I upon the question not whether this measure should retire from office, and give my support is for the advantage of the country-but who to that mease in my private capacity alone. are the parties that propose it. The assumpBut it was made evident to me that my retire- tion is, that to the pressure of external force ment, together with the King's opinion on the we must give way, and that we have no alterCatholic question, would absolutely preclude native but that of satisfying the craving of the the satisfactory settlement of it. I wrote a people. The hon. Gentleman has said," How letter to my noble Friend, expressing an is it that we can have eyes and not see, ears earnest wish to avoid undertaking the painful and not hear, legs and not walk, and how is office. That was on the 12th of July, 1829; it that all our senses do not convince us that but knowing the difficulties with which he was reform must be conceded?" Will he ask the at that time surrounded, I said, "I speak same question of the Marquis of Lansdown, without reserve. If my retirement should who has eyes and ears and legs; but has prove, in your opinion, after the communica- neither seen, nor heard, nor walked, but has tion you have made, an insurmountable ob- for years opposed Parliamentary Reform? stacle to the course you intend to pursue, in Why, in the year 1827, did we see the Marthat case you shall command any service I quis of Lansdown, together with other right can render." The memorandum indorsed on hon. Gentlemen opposite (cheers), taking part that letter states, that the Archbishop of Can-in Mr. Canning's Government, after he had' terbury, the Bishops of London and Durham, declared, to the last moment of his life, he had that day had an audience of the Duke of should be opposed to Parliamentary Reform? Wellington, to declare that they should give (Cheers.) And on this point I find a passage their decided opposition to the proposed plan. in Mr. Stapleton's Memoirs of Mr. Canning, That circumstance made it impossible for me stating, that all the Cabinet was united in sayto retire. I had advised the King to concede ing that the question of Parliamentary Reform the measure. I could not shrink from taking would not be supported by any member of the part in introducing the measure I had advised Government. (Cheers.) After this, I think him to adopt; and no consideration on earth that we have a right to say that we do dread but that should have induced me to stand in the opening of the question of reform. The that place and propose it. But if I believed, noble Lord has asked why we objected to as circumstances had compelled me to believe, accede to his former small motions of reform? that a settlement of the question was necessa- But can he ask this question, after having ry, and that my retirement was an insupera-himself told us, that to those who made the ble obstacle to the settlement, I appeal to any slightest concession he would address himself man of honour whether I should have been in the words of Cromwell: "The Lord has justified in retiring? (Hear, hear, hear.) I had delivered them into my hand"? (Cheers.) I advised the King, and could I, when he said, must say that I think it rather hard that the "I have scruples-you ask me to make sacri-noble Lord should in this manner exonerate fice of them-yet you yourself refuse to make a similar personal sacrifice,"-could I, I say, when thus appealed to as a subject, refuse to undertake the task? (Cheers.) Under these circumstances I did undertake it, and not for the purpose of robbing the original proposers of the honour. (Cheers.) The hon. Member has charged me with having been the cause of the delay in this measure of Reform; and, consequently, of having been the cause of the I did not mention you," from Mr. Macauevils which he says have arisen from that lay.) No; the hon. and learned Gentleman delay. I deny it. I must repeat now what I did not mention me, but the sarcasm was not have before said, that the conduct of the party the less pointed. (Loud cheers.) But I can in giving me their support on the Catholic assure the House that so far from having question, was conduct dictated by the purest taunted the Government with adopting my and most honourable motives, and entitle that principles in their new bill, I have already party to my respect and gratitude. (Hear, stated it as my opinion that the essential prinhear, hear.) I said so at the time; but does ciples of the bill remain unchanged. What I the hon. Member, therefore, think, that with did say, on a former night, was, that I thought fetid breath, and hispering humbleness, I that the country was in a better situation by should shrink from offering opposition to this being afforded this opportunity of re-considerbill? (Hear, hear, hear.) Am I to abate my ing the measure; for which reason I conopposition-am not at liberty to say that Iceived that we had had a great escape, and think the King's Government are in error, if I think them so? If I thought I was disquali

those who have even refused to make the slightest abatement, and fasten himself upon me, because I believe that I once stated that I should be willing to transfer the franchise of a second Grampound to Manchester. Neither do I feel that I have been very fairly dealt with by the hon. and learned Gentleman (Mr. Macaulay), who has taken occasion to compliment me on having sung my Palinodium.

felt thankful to the House of Lords for having acted as it had done. (Cheers.) But as far as

I can see, not only do I rejoice in this, but the this House is behind the improvement of the noble Lord also ought to rejoice, for it times? Is it not rather before it in what it has given him an opportunity of improving did on the Catholic question and on that of his bill, and eulogizing the beauty of the Free Trade? (Cheers.) But another error daughter in preference to that of the mother. which, in my opinion the advocates of reform We have heard their boast this evening of have committed in their arguments, is, that "mater pulchra, filia pulchrior;" and there- they have discussed the question as if it only fore, I hope there is no doubt that the noble applied to this country, quite forgetting the Lord's gallantry will lead him to rejoice that immense colonial possessions of the empire. he is able to enjoy the embraces of the But if it be said that the population of India is daughter rather than those of the mother. (A of so low a grade of intellect as not to underlaugh and cheers.) But, after all, when it is stand the nature of good government, I think considered that I live in the very neighbour- that will only serve to make the case worse; hood of those meetings to whom I have been for if they perceive that change is taking place denounced as "the whisper of a faction " in England, without being able to perceive the (cheers)-to whom I have been held up by justice of that change, it will only lead them the press of the country as a fit subject, not the more doggedly to require a change in their for arguments, but for brick-bats, (cheers), own condition. Another fault is, that the bill I think that it is a little too much to find fault makes no difference between nomination and with me for vindicating a course which an small boroughs. It may be very well to say honest and honourable party pursued, and by that the nomination boroughs must be got which they have afforded an opportunity for rid of; but that shows no cause for destroying what the Government thinks an amendment in the small boroughs also. (Cheers.) Besides, the bill. (Cheers.) I think, however, that the real fact is, that this bill does not destroy after what we have heard in the course of this those very boroughs at which it is said it aims. debate, we must no longer hear of the princi- Look at Midhurst: we have been told over ples of this bill being argued on the ground and over again that the representation of that of the Constitution. The noble Lord dissents place belonged to a hole in a wall; but, after from this, I see; but has he not himself said all, that very hole in the wall is to retain its this evening that if it had been his fortune to right. It is true that the constituency is enhave lived at the period of the Revolution, helarged; but the place itself continues the himself would have voted for the maintenance same. In an address from Walsall, I find that and continuance of the small boroughs? the abolition of the East India monopoly and of (Cheers.) But surely, if these small boroughs the traffic in the flesh and blood of negroes, are now contrary to the spirit of the Constitu- is particularly insisted upon. Now, I do not tion, they would have been equally so at the mean to say that all this is not very honestly time of the Revolution, and it would conse- intended; but what I am afraid of is, that quently have been out of the power of the when we get a popular Parliament, we shall noble Lord to have voted in their support. find it jumping to conclusions-conclusions (Hear, hear.), Allusion had been made to the that may be right, but which, from the great Bill of Rights, and the declaration contained variety of interests they embrace, require the therein, that elections should be free; but this nicest caution and consideration in their madeclaration by no means refers to the small nagement. (Cheers.) In the same way with boroughs, but to the circumstances mentioned respect to property, I am in no fear of its dein the preamble, which arose out of the inter-struction by confiscation; but I am afraid ference of King James II. with the election of that steps will be taken, the ultimate tendmembers, and which is particularly described (ency of which will be to shake the confidence by Reresby, who gives an account of his being of the country; and that confidence once desired by the King to stand for York, to shaken, there will be an end at once to the which he consented, on the condition that the chief stimulus which induces men to amass King should put out of the Corporation of property, and which, in England, has hitherto York all those members to which Reresby ob- been productive of that wealth, commerce, and jected, and which James accordingly did: so power, which have given her so high a station that from this it appeared clear that the de- among the nations of Europe. Let us for a claration in the Bill of Rights in nowise ap-moment look at the state of France! What plied to the small boroughs, in favour of which the noble Lord would have fought on his stumps if he had lived at that time. I am ready to admit that if there does not exist an elastic spirit in the Constitution so as to meet the temper of the times, that there is something wrong, something that requires alteration and that if the boroughs are made of such iron stuff that they will not yield to the impression of improvement, the attempt to put them down is justifiable. But will any one, after looking at the progress of the Legislature since the year 1827, say that the animus of

is the condition of the working people there? Why, although they have not to meet the heavy taxation that exists in this country, their state is most deplorable; and it is found that in every part of that kingdom the situation of the industrious classes is such, that it almost becomes a question whether they will ever be able to recover their former vigour, and reassert that position which the industry of every country ought ever to possess. (Cheers.) The right hon. Baronet, at the conclusion of the quotation, said, that this was the case of a country with an increased army and an in

strengthen their own popularity, and enable them to command an extent of that proportion after the recess. I say nothing of the justice but if it be intended ultimately to concede, Í say give way at once. (Cheers.) While yet giving way has the merit of concession, I repeat, as I said before, that I am most decidedly opposed to the principles of this bill, 1 expected that the Ministers would bring in a Reform Bill on their acceptance of office; but I believe, in my conscience, that the concessions made by the Government have been far too large, and that it was most averse to bring

creasing revenue. (Hear, hear.) Did he therefore say that the French were not right in resisting tyranny? No such thing. But he said that the effect of all such changes in Government were to suspend commerce, to derange industry, to put a stop to credit, and injure almost to death, all the manufacturing and labouring classes. He said that to show that any chauge in the constitution of a country exposed to hazard its dearest interests; and he said it because he was sure, if such a change were made here, property would be unjustly attacked, and the destruction of this country would be sealed the instant its pro-in so large a measure of reform within six perty was not secure. He was afraid that the weeks after they had taken office, and while 10. householders would not pay the same re- the country was yet agitated by the events of spect to those institutions on which property the French revolution. (Hear, hear.) It depended; he did not say that they would be must not be supposed, as I have stated, that I guilty of confiscation, but from not respecting was ready to support moderate reform that I the institutions in the same degree, they would have listened to any insinuations, and am shake the public confidence, and lead to con- keeping back when I may find a time to bring sequences as bad as coufiscation. (Hear, forward a moderate plan of reform, and dishear.) I oppose the bill, said the right hon possess the Government. I may be obliged to Baronet, because I repel all participation in submit by necessity to a plan of reform I cannot the responsibility of such a measure; and I successfully oppose, but believing as I do that vote against the second reading, not that I the people of this country are grossly deceived expect to be successful in my opposition, but grossly deluded-in their expectations of the because I will enter my solemn protest against practical benefits they will derive from reform, incurring any responsibility in making one of shall not be precluded from declaring my the greatest and most precipitate changes ever opinion, and opposing that reform as long as I made in a constitution, which was so good, can. The right hon. Baronet then adverted to that the change ought not to be made, because the sacrifice he was ready to make of office, that constitution was the best that ever existed and the impossibility that office could be of in the annals of history. (Cheers.) You any advantage to him, though he admitted to should well consider the ultimate and imme-seek it was au object of honourable ambition; diate effects of the change you are about to and then went on-I will continue my oppoaccomplish on the three parts of the empire. sition to the last, believing as I do that this Look well to the proportions that were estab-is the first step, not directly to revolution, but lished at the Union. Ireland may be disturbed to a series of changes which will affect the from other causes; but the Reform Bill in its property, and alter the mixed constitution, of principles, and the course pursued by the Go- the country-believing that it will be fatal to verument in agitating, besides the question of the authority of the House of Lords, and will concession, the question of relative proportions force on a series of further concessions. I will of the representation of the different parts of oppose it to the last, convinced that though my the empire, which was agitated by the Govern- opposition will be unavailing, it will not be ment altogether unnecessarily-(bear, hear), fruitless, because the opposition now made -had disarranged-apart from the question will oppose a bar to further concessions hereof the nomination boroughs-all the relations after. If the whole of the House were now to of the empire, was pregnant with mischief, join in giving way, it will have less power to and calculated, more directly and immediately resist future changes. On this ground I stand, than any other cause, to produce extensive not opposed to any well-considered reform of dissatisfaction and discontent. It is not in the auy of our institutions which the well-being spirit of hostility, but from the common inte- of the country demands, but opposed to this rest which I take with the Ministers in the reform in our constitution, because that shatwelfare of the country, that I implore the Go-ters the feelings of respect towards it which vernment not to suffer this House to separate for the recess without proclaiming the course they mean to pursue-not with respect to the deliberations on the Reform Bill, but with respect to the proportious they mean to preserve as to the members for the different parts of the empire. I say nothing of the justice of the proceeding; but I do fear that the course pursued by the Government-though its propositions may assume the semblance of justice, and though it may be perhaps resolved at length to concede-may place an instrument in the hands of those who may use it to

are founded in prejudice perhaps, or in higher feelings of veneration for all our institutions. I believe that reform will do this, and I will wield all the power I possess to oppose the gradual progress of that spirit of democracy to which the hon. and learned Gentleman thinks we ought gradually to yield; for if we make those concessions, it will only lead to establish the supremacy of that principle. We may, I know, make it supreme; we may be enabled to establish a republic, full, I have no doubt, of energy, slender, I have no doubt, with talent, but fatal to our mixed form of Govern.

ment, and ultimately destructive of all those and let THE LIAR and the bloody old usages and practices which have long preserved Times, and let the Greys and the Lambs to us a large share of peace and prosperity, and have made and preserved this the proudest and the Russells and the “Broughams,” kingdom in the annals of the world. [The chew the cud upon it, too; only taking right hon. Gentleman sat down amidst long along with you the facts, that this report and loud cheering.] is copied by me from The United States Gazette, published at PHILADELPHIA, and dated Oct 20, 1831; that

TO THE ATTORNEY-GENERAL. that Gazette (as large a sheet as that of